New things:
Classical Email Directory Guestbook!
Regular users of this page will know that I have been absolutely pathetic about updating sites. I have a bunch of lists to run, and pages to maintain, and actual work :) and have been terrible about taking people's mailed in list info and organizing them to the table format of the page and htmling them and all. Anyway, to simply my life and make this list more current, I've added a guestbook. Guestbook has two purposes:
1. You can leave public feedback
2. More importantly, if you have a list you want to add to the list or information you wish to update, put it right in the guest book and it will be immediately accessible. And I'll be able to transfer your information over to the main page much more easily.
Sign the Classical List Directory Guestbook
View the Classical List Directory Guestbook
The directory is first. Following the directory is a rather long section with instructions on how to work with the programs that administrate the lists, as well as things to remember when participating in a list.
Below is a chart giving the subscription instructions and a short description of each list. Please mail me if there is a list you run or are a member of that I do not list. Please send your mail to jgreshes@netaxs.com and put as your subject line "list submission" In the past I haven't been great about updating the list b/c I get tons of administrative messages a day and just lose track of loose submissions for this page. Using the subject line "list submission" will send the message to reserved mail box.
Depending on how your system displays tables, some lines in the subscription information box may run over-length and be continued onto another line, which a hyphen stuck in the address. If that is the case for you, try setting your browser to use a smaller font, and/or expand your browser to full screen. The reason I ask you to do this is that the addresses will not work if your browser is inserting hyphens where they don't belong.
The lists below run the gamut in specificity--classm-l has no real list topic at all, while other
lists may focus on particular composers, genres, or even instruments. You will receive a
welcome message that will include any instructions as far as limiting discussion to certain
topics. Please remember that every list in this chart has a listowner who monitors the list and
knows what topics people are posting about. If you think someone is posting off-topic
messages, contact THE LISTOWNER if he or she has not dealt with the problem. Do not start
posting messages to the list complaining about off-topic posts. Your complaints themselves
are off-topic, and usually generate more off-topic reply mail than the original offender. The list
topic is a matter under the control of the listowner. Please allow the listowner to manage the
list.
General lists
These lists are general interest lists without specific topics. Generally, classm-l is for
discussion of any kind of instrumental classical music, opera-l is for discussion of most
classical/opera-related music with voice (ie, opera, lieder, broadway, etc.), while classical
encompasses whatever classical music-related topics subscribers wish to discuss. to receive the digest version, add
to your message, following the
command above: set classical digest -or- use the web page: subscribe classm-l Your Name to receive the digest version, add
to your message, following the
command above: set classm-l digest subscribe opera-l Your Name to receive the digest version, add
to your message, following the
command above: set opera-l digest subscribe phonogram or subscribe phonogram-digest for the digest version Vocal genre-specific lists
subscribe c-opera Your Name to receive the digest version, add
to your message, following the
command above: set c-opera digest subscribe lieder-l Your Name to receive the digest version, add
to your message, following the
command above: set lieder-l digest subscribe operetta-l Your Name to receive the digest version, add
to your message, following the
command above: set operetta-l digest subscribe la-divina to receive the digest version: susbcribe la-divina-digest mai listserv@listserv.uh.edu with: subscribe bach-list Your Name to receive the digest version, add to
your message, following the command
above: set bach-list digest List homepage is: http://www.netaxs.com/~jgreshes/lists/bach-list.html subscribe dsch-l Your Name to receive the digest version, add to
your message, following the command
above: set bmusic-l digest List homepage is: http://www.netaxs.com/~jgreshes/lists/dsch--l.html Send e-mail to
LISTSERV@umdd.umd.edu in the body of the message, type SUBSCRIBE HANDEL-L your name Mail
LISTSERV@MAELSTROM.STJOHNS.EDU With: subscribe ludwig Your Name Subscribe mahler-list Your Name to receive the digest version, add to
your message, following the command
above: set mahler-list digest List one: mail listserv@listserv.uh.edu
with: List two: mail
majordomo@earth.colstate.edu with: John Cage list Mail majordomo@bga.com with: Subscribe silence Or Subscribe silence-digest Performer-specific lists Mail majordomo@email.rutgers.edu with: subscribe f_minor (Furtwaengler list) To subscribe, send an email to: furt-l-request@amulation.com The list's FAQ is located at:
http://www.netlink.co.uk/users/music/furt.html [No subscribe info. Mail
c5016694@hkbu.edu.hk for possible info]. subscribe earlym-l Your Name where Your Name is your real
name. To join the digest add the line: set earlym-l digest [Program pretends to be listserv,
but is actually a different server
called LISTPROC. Many listproc
sites masquerade as listserv,
causing some measure of
confusion.] i) medieval, renaissance and baroque music ii) authenticity in music of (these and) later periods, e.g.
classical and romantic. mail majordomo@cs.uwp.edu with
: subscribe post-classical or subscribe post-classical-digest subscribe bmusic-l Your Name to receive the digest version, add
to your message, following the
command above: set bmusic-l digest List homepage is: http://www.netaxs.com/~jgreshes/lists/bmusic-l.html To subscribe, mail
majordomo@lists.oulu.fi with: Subscribe finlandia (Swedish church music) mail listserv@list.ecs.se with: subscribe kyrkomusik-l subscribe kyrkomusik-l For discussions (in swedish) about church music -
instrumental and vocal. The website "Swedish organs on
the net" is maintained by the list owner and points out the
list archive. subscribe scandinavianm-l Your
Name to receive the digest version, add
to your message, following the
command above: set scandinavianm-l digest Performance lists, non-keyboard There are many keyboard instrument lists, so they are in a separate section. Orchestral performance and conducting:
To susbcribe, mail
listproc@hubcap.clemson.edu
with: subscribe orchestralist include an additional command, set orchestralist mail digest to get the digest Mail majordomo@thing.de with: Subscribe termine Promoters of contemporary music are asked to post their
information as detailed as possible as soon as it is
available. You don't have to be a subscriber to post information on
this mailing list, but it is recommended. Vocal performance and conducting:
To subscribe, send email to For more info: http://www.choralnet.org To subscribe, send email to To subscribe, send email to (a list for discussion of and by
vocal performers) To subscribe, mail: Majordomo@lists.oulu.fi To subscribe, mail: majordomo@queernet.org with: Instrumental performance, non-keyboard: Contact: brass-request@gly.fsu.edu How to subscribe: send mail to
cguitar-list-request@eskimo.com with Subject: subscribe Contact: zzboyr@acc.wuacc.edu Mail LISTSERV@LISTSERV.SYR.EDU with: SUB FLUTE Your Name flute-m-request@unixg.ubc.ca Mail majordomo@spock.nlu.edu with: SUBSCRIBE HORN Contact: lute-request@cs.dartmouth.edu
(Wayne B. Cripps) Mail listproc@showme.missouri.edu with: sub tombone-l Your Name Mail majordomo@parnasus.dana.edu with: Subscribe trumpet-l HARPSICHORDS AND RELATED
TOPICS Mail listserv@albany.edu with SUBSCRIBE HPSCHD-L your
name piano-l-request@uamont.edu subscribe piano-l subscribe community-music or community-music digest majordomo@lists.oulu.fi To subscribe, mail
requests@pipechat.org with: Subscribe Firstname Lastname HOMEPAGE: http://www.pipechat.org PIPE ORGANS AND RELATED
TOPICS Mail listserv@albany.edu with SUBSCRIBE PIPORG-L your
name Musicology lists at mailbase.ac.uk mailbase@mailbase.ac.ukTo join euromusicology
send the following command, (typing your own
personal names instead of firstname(s) and
lastname) join euromusicology firstname(s) lastname as the only text in the body of a message
addressed to: mailbase@mailbase.ac.uk http://www.mailbase.ac.uk/lists/euromusicology join ilm firstname(s) lastname as the only text in the body of a message
addressed to: mailbase@mailbase.ac.uk Iberian and Latin-American Music mailing
list (ILM) enables those engaged on
research into music in the Iberian
peninsula and Latin America to exchange
information and ideas. This includes new
archival research, details of relevant conf
erences, publications and work in
progress. join med-and-ren-music firstname(s) lastname as the only text in the body of a message
addressed to: mailbase@mailbase.ac.uk This list enables those engaged on
research into any aspect of Medieval and
Renaissance Music to exchange
information. This includes questions of
research, conference details and reports,
library information and any other useful
materi al. join nineteenth-century-music firstname(s)
lastname as the only text in the body of a message
addressed to: mailbase@mailbase.ac.uk Academic discussion list for the history,
theory and analysis of nineteenth-century
music join musical-aesthetics firstname(s) astname as the only text in the body of a message
addressed to: mailbase@mailbase.ac.uk A philosophical discussion of problems in
musical aesthetics and analytical
approaches, and a forum for debating
current issues in this field. join musicology-all firstname(s) lastname as the only text in the body of a message
addressed to: mailbase@mailbase.ac.uk Lists concerning electronic music Mail
music-research-request@psych.upenn.edu Mail listserv@american.edu with: Subscribe emusic-l Misc. musicology and theory lists Mail
LISTSERV@MAELSTROM.STJOHNS.EDU With: subscribe classica Your Name For more information about CLASSICA list,
point your web browser at our Home Page:
http://www.geocities.com/Vienna/4098 The Society for Music Theory's list. This list is open to professionals and serious
theory students only. To subscribe, just mail
the list address
smt-list@boethius.music.ucsb.edu and your
message will be intercepted by the list owner,
and some questions will be sent to you
concerning subscribing to the list. The homepage for the Society for Music
Theory is: http://boethius.music.ucsb.edu/smt-list/smthome.html This page covers the following subjects--click on the subject to jump to the applicable section. What are email lists? Why join an email list? How do email lists work? What are some basics I need to know? General list participation guidelines? Email is the most common and basic level to the internet. Folks that can't access the Web,
can't access Usenet, can't FTP or use the latest Java doohickies, etc., can send email to
others through the internet. Imagine that you've found a few people that share an interest with you. You want to discuss
that common interest through email. So each of you trades email with one another, with you
forwarding each message you write to the members of your group and each other member
doing the same thing. When it's just five or six of you, that isn't very hard to do. You have a
little email address book, and put the peoples' names in the To line or CC line of your mail
and off you go. What do you do when 200 other people share that interest? Or 1000? Address
book a little full? Email lists solve that problem by having a central address for you and other list subscribers to
write to. You send one message to that central address and copies of your message are sent
to everyone that is interested. The way they show they are interested is by joining the
group--subscribing to the list. Now you only have to write to the central address--the list
address--to write to the others--which is called posting to the list. Some lists are run out of a person's account, with that one person receiving all the messages
and forwarding them out, with that same person keeping track of who has subscribed and who
has left the list--called unsubscribing. Generally, running a list in that way is a big pain in the
butt. Recognizing that that system was too labor intensive for one person, programmers long
ago began writing programs that could administrate much of the process. Most lists are now
run using one of a limited number of programs (which we will get into later) to handle the
mundane aspects of the list. People join the list not by writing to the person who runs the
list--the listowner--but rather by writing to an address that pipes directly to the program running
the list--the list administration program . The most popular list administration program is called
listserv, and this has led some people to call all list administration programs "the listserv." This
isn't accurate usage--listserv isn't the only administration program; the other programs don't
use all the same commands as listserv. Worse, some insist on calling the list itself "the
listserv." Again, not really accurate. Subscribers also write to the administration program to leave the list, to change various
configuration options, etc. The listowner thus can concentrate on managing, monitoring, and
participating in the list. The Internet offers numerous forums for discussing classical music. My favorites are email
lists. The other main forums are usenet newsgroups. Usenet was, in a way, an offshoot of
email lists. For example, say 100 people at a certain system were subscribed to a science
fiction list. Each one of them receives all the list's posts. So 100 copies of each message take
up space on the system. Usenet was a good idea--have set groups, have posts to groups
forwarded automatically to each system, but have the posts set up like a bulletin board, where
only one copy of each message exists on the system and all the users interested can access
the posts. Worked great, except that there is absolutely no security or control over the
forwarding of usenet posts--anyone can post, and individual systems have to either
automatically accept all the posts for that newsgroup or not have the newsgroup at all. Back
when everyone on the net was a researcher, professor, or student that worked. Once the
general public got access to usenet, though, usenet became almost useless. Since nobody
can be prevented from posting, every gibbering idiot with a keyboard can post on usenet and
nobody can do a thing about them, and since there is no security or control over what posts
are accepted, usenet is filled with faked messages, pyramid schemes, etc. etc. etc. The
benefits of lists as opposed to newsgroups are as follows: 1) the message come to you. You don't have to keep checking a newsgroup, the post just
show up in your inbox. 2) list posting is generally limited to members of the list. As a result, you don't have people
posting spams, make money fast schemes, crossposted messages to 20 forums, etc. Also,
there is much less "post and run" type posting. The people participating in the list are usually
folks that plan on belonging to the list long term, and are therefore much less likely to post
something obnoxious or stupid. 3) Because folks are members for long periods of time (I have owned some of my lists for
going on three years now, and several people that subscribed the first week the lists existed
are still members), there is a great deal of institutional memory and knowledge. The negatives are reflections of the positives: 1) messages are always arriving, so if you subscribe to all of these lists you may have days
where you receive 500 pieces of email. If you have mail software that can filter messages to
separate folders (Eudora, Pegasus, and many other programs have this feature built in), the
load isn't quite as daunting--you can pick through the various lists' posts and read those that
interest you, and delete the rest. However, if you receive all mail in one inbox and don't know
how to set your software to automatic ally filter your mail, you might want to start by
subscribing to just one or two heavy traffic lists to gauge whether you can handle the mail
load or not. Another option is receive the list posts as a digest, where instead of receiving
dozens of separate messages, you receive only one or two digests per list a day, with each
digest being a compendium of that day's list posts. 2) because list members have been around for a while and members of the list for long
periods of time, each list has its own "culture" to which new subscribers must acclimate
themselves. The easy hint is to make sure to read the welcome message you receive when
you first subscribe (that message will contain much important information: list policies, rules,
instructions, options, and how to unsubscribe from the list), just sit back and read the list for a
few days before deciding to post yourself, and make your first post a short message
introducing yourself. After that, you should have an idea about how the list's population
interrelates, and the list population will have idea of who you are. Let's take a very simple email list with five subscribers. It is called a list because there exists a
file listing the five subscribers: bob@netcom.com The five have gotten together to discuss pottery and have named their list pottery-l. [Please
note that many list names end in -l (and note that that is "hyphen letter lowercase L" and NOT
"hyphen one"). They end in -l to show that they are a LIST addresses, and not regular user
addresses). Most lists are not run by hand. They are automated. A program or set of programs handles
adding people to the list, unsubscribing them from the list, distributing list posts, and handling
other subscriber requests. For example, we'll say that alice started potter-l by having the other
folks mail her, and she would then distribute the message herself. So, for example, bob would
send her an email about potter and she would then forward that message to ted, al and sue.
Sue would send a response to Alice, and Alice would then forward that response to Bob, Ted,
Al. After a little while, Alice gets tired of forwarding all these messages and wishes she had a
program that would automatically do that for her. In addition, Ted has decided to leave the list,
and June, John and Sam want to join the list. So Alice moves the list to being run by a list
administration program. [The two main list administration programs are majordomo and
listserv.] So now Alice doesn't forward messages to the other members of the list--the program
does. And Alice doesn't need to keep track o f who wants to be on the list and who wants to
leave the list--the program does that for her. Now that Alice's list is run by a program, Alice can let many more people be on the list. Soon
their are 200 hundred people on the list, with several joining the list every day and another
several leaving the list every day. So you must remember that you are dealing with a program, not a person. A program
responds to specific commands written a specific format. Requests written in conversational
English that may be completely comprehensible to a person are gibberish to a program. For
example: "Hi, please add me to the Mahler list" makes perfect sense to a human, h/e is
impossible for a program to understand. In the chart below I give the exact syntax of the
commands you should send. Don't be creative and attempt to add or subtract from what I
suggest. You will only confuse the program. Going back to our pottery-loving friends, when Alice began the list, the users only had to
remember one address--Alice's. If they had a question about the list, they wrote to Alice's
address. If they wanted to join or leave, they wrote to Alice's address. If they wanted to send a
message to the list [called posting] they wrote to Alice's address. When the list moved to
being computer-administrated, that all changed. T he list needs a central address now that Alice wasn't handling the distribution anymore [called
the list address, or, for short, just the list -when people say "wr
ite to the list" they mean send
an email to the list address]. The list needs a separate address people can write to in order to join or leave the list, or to
change their subscription configurations [called the administrative address]. Finally, people need an address to use in order to reach Alice. Some people running lists
[called listowners] don't participate often in list discussion, and subscribers might not know or
remember who the listowner is, so will not know her personal email address. Long ago it
became standardized (well, as much as anything can be standardized on the internet) that
people could also write the listowner at an address that is the list addr ss plus the addition
-owner [called the owner address.] Lists, then, generally have three addresses: Subscribe commands, unsubscribe commands, and any other configuration type commands
go the automated administrative address. Questions, comments, etc. about the list meant to
be read only by the list owner go the list owner address. You can also write to the list owner
address if you have tried everything you can think of to make the list program work but you
still can't get it to do what you want. Various list owners have differing amounts of time they
can devote to the administration of their list s, and it is not unusual for a list owner to take
days to respond to a message sent to them. So even though there is a list owner you can
write to, you can usually get a much quicker result by figuring out how to properly pose your
request to the automate d address. The most common programs used to run lists are: Both work basically the same, but the commands for each have slightly different syntax. Below you will find a generic listing of typical list addresses, and then specific examples.
Where I write listname@system.dom, that doesn't mean their is a list actually called "listname"
or a system called "system.dom" Those are the generics--listname means substitute the
applicable list name of the list your are interested in, system is the generic for any system
name ie "netcom" "aol" etc. Dom is the generic for any domain ie ".com" ".net" ".au" etc. The
specific examples will be for pottery-l, if it was run by each program, with the list being run
from the system clay.com. So, if pottery-l is majordomo list located clay.com, you write to majordomo@clay.com to
subscribe, unsubscribe, etc. You write to pottery-l@clay.com to post to the list, and to
pottery-l-owner@clay.com when you need something that majordomo either can't do for you,
or you can't figure out how exactly to tell majordomo to do what you want it to do. The next section will cover how to do the most common tasks relating to lists. There will be a
section covering majordomo lists, and a section covering listserv lists. Please keep this in
mind: listserv lists all work the same. There might be an oddball or two out there, but for the
most part if you know how to subscribe to one listserv list, you know how to subscribe to all of
them. If you know how to unsubscribe from one listserv list, you know how to unsubscribe
from all of them. One nice thing about listservs is that there are all connected--if you send
your subscribe message to the wrong listserv, it will forward your request to the listserv now
hosting the list you have identified. So, if you know a list is hosted by a listserv server, and
you know the name of the list, you can subscribe by writing to any listserv server. (The only complication to keep in mind is in the beginning listserv was written for machines
running an operating system called VMS and was not a commercial program. Some people
got together and wrote a version for UNIX and also called it listserv. Down the line, listserv
became a commercial program available for additional operating systems such as UNIX and
Windows. The alternative listserv program's name was changed to listproc. Listproc servers
are not interconnected, are not connected to listserv servers, do not forward subscribe
requests, and now sport different syntax for performing many operations. Which wouldn't be a
problem except that some administrators using listproc insist on pretending their servers are
listserv servers and have listserv@whatever as the administrative address. I've tried to identify
the systems trying to pull this trick, but may have missed a few.) We will go back and forth between the two programs, listserv and majordomo, and will
continue to use pottery-l as our example. The first thing you need to do is join the list. Majordomo and listserv are slightly different in
that listserv keeps track of what your name is, in addition to your email address. For example,
if you are Doug Jones and you have the email address djones@aol.com, majordomo only
cares about your address---djones@aol.com. Listserv, on the other hand, needs to know your
email address, djones@aol.com, but also wants to know who you are. Listserv lists are
generally more "serious" i n nature than majordomo lists, and it is kind of expected that folks
joining a listserv list don't need to hide who they are. To subscribe, you send a subscribe command to the program that runs the list. Commands go
in the body of your message, not Subject line. Example of a message: ------------------------------------------------ Jason, could you have gone into a bit more painful detail on your page? Doug ------------------------------------------------ Note that there's a section of the message with To, From, and Subject. That section is called
the header and usually contains a few other lines, as well--the date the message was sent, for
example. H/e, when typing in your message the To, From and Subject lines will usually be the
only ones you are dealing with. The To line is what address the message is going to. The
From line is usually set automatically to your address--many email programs won't even show
the From line when you are writing the message, but you should know that line is there. The
Subject line is where you indicate what your message is about. Listserv and majordomo do not look at the subject line. To subscribe to a listserv list, you write to: listserv@system.dom For example, to join pottery-l@clay.com, you write to: listserv@clay.com The request you send is: subscribe listname Your Name Where Your Name is your real name. For example, Doug Jones would join pottery-l by
sending the message: subscribe pottery-l Doug Jones To subscribe to a majordomo list, you write to: majordomo@system.dom For example, to join pottery-l@clay.com, you write to: majordomo@clay.com The request you send is: subscribe listname For example, Doug Jones would join pottery-l by sending the message: subscribe pottery-l Majordomo doesn't care what Doug's name is, it just wants to know that he wants to join the
list. Please note that neither program asks for your email address. Why not? Well, remember how
I told you that your mail program automatically sticks in a From line? Majordomo and listserv
read the info in that From line use that to add your email address to the list. Subscription confirmation messages One problem that turned up on the net is that people would send out subscribe messages with
fake From lines. For example, if they were pissed at someone that would send out hundreds
of subscribe requests using that person's address in the From line. That person would then be
subbed to, and receiving mail from, hundreds of lists. This got to be a really problem around
late-1995. Realizing there was a problem, the authors of listserv added a feature: lists can be set so that
when listserv gets a subscribe command from someone it won't automatically add them to a
list. Instead, it sends out message asking whether that person is sure they want to join the list.
The new subscriber simply replies to that message, and once the reply is received by listserv
they are added to the list. That way, if someone fakes a subscription request their victim
doesn't get added to the lis t. They just get an "are you sure" message, and if they don't want
to join the list they just don't respond to the "are you sure" message. Some of the people that ran majordomo lists also wanted this feature. However, new versions
of majordomo appear much more slowly than new versions of listserv, and so a few people
wrote an add-on to present majordomo program that will cause it to send confirmation
requests. Because it is an add-on and not built into the program, many majordomo sites never
added it. Also, some listserv list owners don't know about the feature or have never bothered
to use it. In short, sometimes you will get a confirmation request message, sometimes you won't--it
depends on the list. If you get one and wish to join the list, reply as the message instructs. If
you receive a confirmation request message and do not re ply to it, you will not be added to
the list. Usually you have 48 hours to reply to the message. Wait longer and your initial
request expires and you would need to send another subscribe request. One constant source of amazement for listowers is the trouble some people have
unsubscribing. Unless your system mucks up your email address sometime between when
you subscribe and when you want to unsubscribe, getting off a list is the easiest thing in the
world. To unsubscribe, send a message to the adminstrative address saying: unsubscribe listname Examples: If pottery-l was a listserv list at clay.com you would write to listserv@clay.com with the
message: unsubscribe pottery-l If pottery-l was a majordomo list at clay.com you would write to majordomo@clay.com with the
message: unsubscribe pottery-l Not exactly difficult. The one and only problem people attempting to unsubscribe run into that isn't simply them
screwing up the unsubscribe command is when the people that run their system have messed
around with their email address. What do I mean by this? Explanation: Remember when I said majordomo and listserv read your address from the From line of your
subscribe command, and add that address to the list? Let's take Bob Davis, a person who has an account at pitt.com as an example. Bob's account
is bdavis. His email address when he subscribes to the list is bdavis@pitt.com. He's on the list
for months. Eight months after subscribing to the list, he's going on vacations for a few weeks
(or is just sick of pottery) and wants to leave the list. Problem: the idiots that run his system
have fooled around when the system configuration so that messages from Bob no longer have
From lines of bdavis@pitt. com. His mail now goes out saying it is from
bdavis@mailhost.pitt.com. The problem is that majordomo and listserv are just programs--they
execute commands, they don't figure things out. When they get an unsubscribe command
from bdavis@mailhost.pitt.com they try to find that address is the subscribe file. They can't
find it because it isn't there. There are two things to do. First, complain to the people that run your system because they
shouldn't have screwed with system configuration in the first place, and should fix it. I've had
the exact same mail address for years. Over that time, my system has swapped machines,
reconfigured their network seventy times, changed their mail machine, I changed the type of
account that I have--BUT THE ADDRESS OF MY ACCOUNT HAS NEVER CHANGED. Your
shouldn't change either. It doesn't have to--the people that run your system are just being
lazy. Complain. That doesn't help in the short term, however, so what you need to do is write to the list owner
asking him/her to remove you from the list. What you should do is first attempt to find out what
address you were originally subscribed as. The easiest way is to get a copy of the subscriber
file, take a look through the file, and find your old address. Then email the listowner to ask
them to remove that old address. Here's the steps, using pottery-l as an example: For a majordomo list: write to majordomo@system.dom with the request: who listname For pottery-l you would write to pottery-l@clay.com with the request: who pottery-l After you get the file mailed to you, find your address in it, and write to the list ower. The
listowner address will be listname-owner@system.dom For pottery-l, you would write to: pottery-l-owner@clay.com For a a listserv list: write to listserv@system.dom with the request: review listname For pottery-l you would write to listserv@clay.com with the request: review pottery-l Note that majordomo and listserv use different commands. Some lists are private--you cannot
get the subscribe file if you are not a subscriber. Since your problem is that you address does
not match an existing subscriber, you can't get the sub scribe file on a private list. So then all
you can do is write to the list owner. Another big question from some subscribers is how to get the list in digest form. What's a
digest? The default for most lists is that people send in a message to the list and *boom* that
message is piped out to the members of the list. Someone sends another message five
minutes later and that message is sent to everyone. If twenty messages are sent to the list
that day, the list subscribers receive twenty message each. A digest is a different way of receiving the list. Instead of receiving twenty separate messages,
you receive once a night the twenty posts put together in one piece of email. Digests are
easier to manage if you are a member of several lists b/c instea d of receiving dozens and
dozens of separate emails, you only receive one digest or two a day from each list. 1) not all lists have them 2) digests are difficult to respond to--usually when you respond to the message, you hit reply
and your message has the same subject as the message you are replying to. The message
you are reply to is quoted into your message, and you can cut and snip the parts you aren't
reply to. With a digest, the subject line isn't kept and you have to re-enter it. Usually, either the
entire digest is quoted--in which case you have major snipping to do--or nothing is quoted, in
which case people can't see what you are replying to. So getting the digest is good for people
that want to read the list but do not wish to participate in the list. Digests aren't good for
people that want to participate. 3) when you receive the list as separate posts [called loose mail] you can easily delete
messages you aren't interested in--just hit D) on most programs. When you get the digest, on
the other hand, you can either delete the whole digest or nothing. So if there's a ten page post
on a subject you don't care about, on the loose mail version you can tell from the first screen
full that you aren't interested, so you hit D) and move on. When you get the digest, you have
to page through all then pages to get to the next message. As a result of this, people that get
lists in digest versions usually quit someone through each digest and messages that appear at
the end of the digest are often never read by digest subscribers. 4) for most people, digests aren't necessary. Most common mail programs can now filter
incoming email. For example, I use a program called Pegasus. I have set Pegasus to look at
the headers of incoming mail. It can pick out certain patterns. M ail from a list usually shows
up with the list name in To: line of the header. So list mail can be filtered by the To: line. I set
Pegasus to take all incoming messages from classm-l (a large classical music list) and stick
them in a separate folder called classm-l. That accomplished the same goal as receiving the
digest--not letting list mail overwhelm your regular mail--while still giving me separate
messages I can read and reply to. That said, here's how to get the digest version, using pottery-l as an example: Getting the digest version of listserv lists: Listserv keeps a subscriber file with your email address, real name, and various configuration
options for you. For example, it keeps track of whether you want digest or loose mail, whether
you want to receive copies of your own posts or not, whether you want to receive a message
from listserv telling you that your posts have been received by listserv, etc. You modify your
configuration using the SET command. The command works like this: SET listname option Digest is an option. So you send the command: SET listname digest To stop getting the digest, you use the option nodigest. So you send the command: SET listname nodigest When you first subscribe to a listserv list, usually listserv will assume you want to be nodigest.
So you have to tell listserv that you want the digest option. For pottery-l, you would mail listserv@clay.com with: SET pottery-l digest You can include multiple commands in one message, so when first subscribing to a listserv list
you can also include the set command on another line. For example, to subscribe to pottery-l
and choose the digest in one message, you do: subscribe pottery-l Doug Jones That message will subscribe Doug to the list and set him to receive the digest. Subscribing to the digest on a majordomo list Majordomo is a much dumber program than listserv. It doesn't keep track of options, it just
keeps track of names. As a result, the digest version of a majordomo list is actually a separate
list. Messages sent to one list and forwarded by majordomo to the other list, but the lists have
separate subscribe files and different list addresses. The list addresses for a majordomo digest list are: administrative address: continues to be majordomo@system.dom [Please note that majordomos are frequently misconfigured as far as the digest, so the owner
address might not work--just use listname-owner as the owner address.] So for pottery-l the addresses are: list address: pottery-l-digest@clay.com Now here's the tricky parts: Because the digest is a separate list, you can't just change your option like you could with
listserv. Intead, you must unsubscribe from the regular list and subscribe to digest version.
While you can just subscribe to the digest from the star t, if you are already part of the loose
mail list and try to switch by just subbing to the digest you will find that you are then
subscribed to the loose mail list AND the digest. To subscribe, from the start, to the digest version, mail majordomo@system.dom with: subscribe listname-digest For pottery-l, that would be: subscribe pottery-l-digest To switch from loose mail to the digest, mail majordomo@system.dom with: subscribe listname-digest So for pottery-l your message would be: subscribe pottery-l-digest When you join the digest, you should continue to post to regular list address. You should be
able to post by writing to the -digest list address, but again majordomos are often configured
improperly so you are best off writing to the loose mail list address. Please be advised that the below might also be subtitled "Zen and the Annoyed Listowner." It
is a collection of suggestions and pet peeves that for whatever reasons don't get included in
the normal "The Internet and You" type books. Nothing below is gospel, and please don't take
offense to anything included Below are some simple guidelines for participating in email lists. Please keep in mind that if a
list has sufficient traffic to generate daily posts, that list will have a list culture. Subscribing to a
list is like going to neighborhood bar, or, for you more upscale folks, a wine and cheese party
at a friend's. There are ways you behave, and ways you don't behave. These are general
notes. Each list may send you a copy of its own policies when you join. Some of these instructions may seem negative to you. I'm sorry if some give you a bad
impression of email lists. Most lists will have several hundred subscribes, ten of which may be
a royal pain in the behind. Many of these instructions are meant to guide you away from
behavior usually associated with those nasty ten. One: Read the note on the door
CLASSICAL
mail listserv@home.ease.lsoft.com
with:
subscribe classical Your Name
http://www.classical.net/music/subscrib.html Classical is the Moderated Classical Music List, a high
volume but high quality list hosted by Dave Lampson. The
list is moderated, meaning that incoming messages are
okayed by Dave before they are sent to the list. This cuts
down/eliminates non-classical music posts, one line chat
messages, mistracked personal emails, etc. The list
subject is discussion of classical music, with no specialty
as far as period, or genre (chamber, orchestral, vocal
classical music all qualify as being on-topic). Classical is a
high traffic list. You can get additional information through:
http://www.classical.net If you are interested in joining only
one classical music list, Dave's is the list to join. Highly
recommended, and I'm "the competition." ;)CLASSM-L
mail listserv@brownvm.brown.edu
with:
Dave Lampson's Moderated Classical Music List was
started, at least in part, as an option to classm-l. Classm-l
is the oldest classical music list on the internet, but rather
than being a list about classical music, classm-l is a list
made up of people that listen to classical music but
discuss many topics. There is no set list topic or limitations
on classm-l. Generally, however, classm-l discussion does
not involve vocal music. Classm-l is, much of the time,
very high traffic, with much of the traffic not involving
classical music. However, many find it stimulating to
discuss many topics with others that share a common
interest, so classm-l and classical are equal alternatives.
I'm now the listowner over at classm-l, after the list had
spent a couple of years with no one running the thing.
The list had gotten more than a bit chaotic, but now is
much calmer and a good list to join for classical chat.
Probably the best list for you to join if you are looking to
meet other classical fans. OPERA-L
mail listserv@cunyvm.cuny.edu
with:
Opera-l is the other grand daddy internet list. Opera-l
resides on the City University of New York's server, and is
run by Bob Kosovsky. Opera-l once spewed forth
hundreds of kilobytes a day discussing opera and every
other subject under the sun, but the amount of traffic
crashed its old host and forced relocation to CUNY. CUNY
also couldn't handle the load, so now the number of posts
a day distributed by opera-l is restricted, resulting in
subscribers focusing much more on opera and other vocal
music (operetta some, lieder a little bit, and Broadway a
very little bit) as the list topic. Opera-l is still a high volume
list (50-75 messages a day) but also a very high quality
list. Again, if you are only going to join one list and are a
fan of vocal music, opera-l is your list to join. Phonogram
To subscribe, mail
majordomo@graphics.cornell.edu
with:
Phonogram is a discussion group for those who listen to,
collect, or otherwise enjoy music on records. The group is
an open, informative, interesting, and just plain fun place
for people to share their enthusiasm for, knowledge of, and
opinions on music on shiny black discs. Although the
focus is primarily on 33 1/3 RPM vinyl LPs, comments and
questions on 45s, 78s, reel to reel tapes, or other media
(even CeeDees) are welcome. Discussion of hardware
supporting record playback (e.g., turntables, tonearms,
cartridges, phono stages, and accessories) is fair game as
well. Whatever material related to the
enjoyment of records that catches the members' interest is
welcome grist for the discussion mill.
C-OPERA
mai listserv@hermes.csd.unb.ca
with:
For discussion concerning contemporary opera and music
theatre LIEDER-L
mail listserv@listserv.uh.edu
with:
Lieder-l is a list devoted to discussion of the art song. Art
songs include German lieder (hence the list name), French
melodies, and art songs in many other languages:
Russian, English, Czech, etc. The list is called lieder-l b/c
lieder is the most commonly known type of art song, but
the list itself is not restricted to discussion of German
songs. OPERETTA-L
mail listserv@listserv.uh.edu
with:
Operetta-l is devoted to discussion of operetta, classic
Broadway musicals, Gilbert & Sullivan,
Weill/Bernstein/Gershwin, and light concert music. LA-DIVINA
mail majordomo@smoe.org with:
Discussion concerning Maria Callas.
BACH-LIST (JS Bach and the rest of
the Bach composers)
Bach-list is for discussion of JS Bach, the other Bach
family composers, as well as baroque and early
classical music in general.
BRAHMS-L mail
majordomo@earth.colstate.edu with
subscribe brahms-lFor discussion of Brahms and his music. CHOPIN-L mail
majordomo@earth.colstate.edu with
subscribe chopin-lFor discussion of Chopin and his music. DSCH-L (Shostakovich and Other
Russian/Soviet composers and music)
mail listserv@listserv.uh.edu with:
Although the name is DSCH-L, the list was
conceived as a Russian classical music list, with
emphasis on Shostakovich.
HANDEL-L
HANDEL-L is a discussion list sponsored by The
American Handel Society devoted to discussion of
the life and times of George Frideric Handel
(1685-1759) and that of his contemporaries whose
work was related to his. LISZT-L mail
majordomo@earth.colstate.edu with
subscribe listzt-lFor discussion of Liszt and his music LUDWIG
For discussion of Beethoven, his music, his life,
recordings, etc. MAHLER-LIST (Mahler and Other
Late-Romantic Composers and Music)
mail listserv@listserv.uh.edu with:
Mahler-list centers around discussion of Mahler and
his music, but also is intended to be a list for
discussion of late and post-romantic music, generally
anything from Brahms to Korngold. It has also
become the place to discuss various old-time
conductors, such as Walter, Klemperer, Barbirolli,
etc. List homepage is:
http://www.netaxs.com/~jgreshes/lists/mahler-list.html
SCHUBERT-L
subscribe schubert-l Your name
subscribe schubert-l Believe it or not, there are two Schubert lists. I
started one when I didn't know the other existed. The
one I started has a few more subscribers, a little bit
more activity (little activity, compared to none for the
other list.) Go ahead and join both--I guarantee the
traffic will not kill you. SCHUMANN-L mail
majordomo@earth.colstate.edu with
subscribe schumann-lFor discussion of Schumann and his music. SILENCE
This list is for discussions of the music, philosophies,
writings, art, life, influences, and influence of the late
John Cage. The list includes a wide range of
members, ranging from those who have recently
read or heard of him for the first time to experts on
his work. It is not connected in any way with the
John Cage estate.
F_minor
This mailing list is for the discussion of the
recordings, broadcasts and philosophy of the
Canadian pianist Glenn Gould. FURT-L
This is an unmoderated list for discussion of
the life and work of the German conductor
Wihelm Furtwaengler.
HOROWITZ, VLADMIR
This mailing list is the discussion on the great
pianist, Vladmir Horowitz, whether it is his
recordings, his approach to music and any
other thing of his.
EARLYM-L
mail
LISTSERV@AEARN.ACO.NET
with:
EARLYM-L and the newsgroup rec.music.early are
linked. They were created to provide a forum for
exchange of news and views about
(sacred and secular - both `art' and `folk')
derived as part of European culture, its
researchers, performers, instruments,
instrument-makers, festivals, concerts and
societies, records, song texts and translations,
machine-readable notations of (early) music; POST-CLASSICAL
Purpose: For the discussion of artists and their works who
fall within the following boundaries: 1) Derivative - artists
generally considered outside the classical genre but
whom incorporate traditional classical components in a
predominantly unconventional manner. Instrumentation
may either be accoustically or electronically generated,
but usually fused with another musical style. 2)
Experimental - artists generally considered within the
classical genre but whom work outside the boundaries of
traditional classical structure. Instrumentation is usually
acoustically generated, but often by unconventional
means.)
BMUSIC-L (British Classical
Music)
mail listserv@listserv.uh.edu
with:
Bmusic-l is a list devoted to discussion of British classical
and folk music. All time periods are included, as open for
discussion, as are all British (UK and Ireland) composers,
performers (past and present), ensembles, labels,
publishers, organizations, etc.
FINLANDIA
The purpose of Finlandia is to offer a forum of discussion
about Finnish classical and modern composers, their life
and works, performing artists and orchestras, Finnish
publications (scores, books, sheet music etc.), recordings
(CD, LP - even video) and the music life in general.
Subscriptions from specialists in Finnish music are warmly
appreciated! Archives at:
ftp://ftp.lists.oulu.fi/pub/majordomo/finlandia.archive/
KYRKOMUSIK-L
Mail <listserv@list.ecs.se> with:
SCANDINAVIANM-L (British
Classical Music)
mail listserv@listserv.uh.edu
with:
Scandinavianm-l is a list devoted to discussion of
Scandinavianclassical and folk music. All time periods are
included, as open for discussion, as are Scandinavian
composers, performers (past and present), ensembles,
labels, publishers, organizations, etc.
ORCHESTRALIST (professional
list for orchestra members and
composers)
Orchestralist is a list intended for
professionals--performers and composers. Anyone can
subscribe, but posting is reserved for profesionals. TERMINE
TERMINE is designed to be a source of information for
professional users who need to be informed about
upcoming concerts of contemporary music very far ahead
of time.
CHORALIST
listproc@lists.colorado.edu
and in the body of the message, put
subscribe choralist Firstname LastnamePurpose: For the exchange of information and ideas between
practicing choral conductors. Choralist is open to anyone
but is specifically oriented towards information
dissemination
for the choral conducting professional.
CHORALACADEME
listproc@lists.colorado.edu
and in the body of the message,
put
subscribe choralacademe
Firstname LastnameChoralAcademe is dedicated to the exchange of
information and ideas between practicing choral scholars.
ChoralAcademe is open to anyone but is specifically
oriented towards research into choral performance
practice and other information for the choral profession. If
you are a music student or singer, your presence is
welcome, but please bear in mind that the list is intended
to serve choral professionals. CHORALTALK
listproc@lists.colorado.edu
and in the body of the message,
put
subscribe choraltalk Firstname
LastnameChoralTalk is intended to be a forum for more informal
and extended discussion of choral music topics than
which is permitted/allowed on Choralist. It is open to
conductors, singers, administrators, and students, but the
primary rules is that the topics relate to choral music and
musicians. VOCALIST
subscribe vocalist VOCALIST was started to get together singers all over the
world and to offer a forum of discussion on teaching and
studying singing. On the mailing list subscribers talk about
technique, repertoire and interpretation am ong other
things. All levels of skill and all styles of singing are
covered and there are over 600 subscribers. The
language of the list is English and it is open to everyone.
For information, go to http://www.vocalist.org CHORUS
subscribe chorus
Formed in late 1991, the chorus mailing list is a forum for
discussion of gay & lesbian choruses, their operations &
performances. Membership to the mailing list is open to
all, straight or gay, performing or non-performing,
chorus member or no.
BRASS
Purpose: A discussion group for people
interested in brass musical performance and
related topics, especially small musical
ensembles of all kinds. List owner:
zateslo@gly.fsu.edu (Ted Zateslo) CGUITAR-L
Brief description: This list is concerned with
all aspects of the classical guitar -
construction, playing, music for the guitar,
guitar compositions etc.. DOUBLEREED-L
Purpose: For discussion of all matters relating
to doublereed instruments, including
fingerings, care of instruments, music, cane,
acoustics, instruments for sale, upcoming
interesting performances, etc. FLUTE
An unmoderated mailing list devoted to flute
related matters. All topics related to both
professional and amateur flute playing will be
warmly accepted. Flute players, teachers,
students, makers, repair technicians, and
anyone with an interest in the flute are
encouraged to participate. FLUTE-M
This a mailing list to facilitate the discussion of
the flute. Appropriate topics include: flute
playing, players, and flute music. Owner: Cara
Camcastle <camcastl@unixg.ubc.ca> HORNS (International Horn Society maillist)
This Internet discussion group is administered
in the name of the International Horn Society,
and its purpose is to provide a forum for
electronic conversation about all things
relating to the (French) horn: repertoire,
teachers and students, pedagogy, workshop
and festival announcements, alternate
fingerings, the nasty business about whether
stopping raises or lowers pitch, horn players
versus conductors, horn humor and
anecdotes, instrumental repair and technology,
scholarly reports, orchestra or band music,
chamber ensembles, relations with other brass
instruments, or anything else the subscribers
may want to take on. Although the initial list
was sponsored by the International Horn
Society, list membership is open to all
interested HISTORIC BRASS
To get all messages of the list, send an email
to
anzenberger@gmx.net giving a few words
about yourself and yourresearch interests and
you will be added to the list within a few days.
LUTE
Purpose: For lute players and researchers of
lute music. brass TROMBONE-L
Trombone performer's list. TRUMPET-L
This unmoderated list is devoted to the subject
of the trumpet. Messages on the topic of the
trumpet or anything related to it are allowed on
this list. The individuals posting messages
here are solely responsible for the content of
their own messages.
http://trumpet.dana.edu/~trumpet
HPSCHD-L
HPSCHD-L is devoted to early stringed keyboard
instruments: harpsichords, clavichords, fortepianos,
virginals, and all similar instruments except the modern
piano. The list is an open forum for all topics related to
these instruments, including their theory and principles of
construction, decoration, and history and evolution from
their earliest beginnings through modern times. Other
topics for discussion include performers on these
instruments, performance practice, literature, pedagogy,
care and ownership. We may also stray to include ads of
instruments/music/ recordings for sale or wanted,
discussion of performances or recordings, and musical
editions KEYB-LIT-L mail
majordomo@earth.colstate.edu
with
subscribe keyb-lit-lFor discussion of keyboard literature PIANO-L
A list for discussion among piano performers and
educators. Archives available at:
http://www.uamont.edu/www/Archives.htmlYou can subscribe to the list by
sending an e-mail with the text (not
subject) subscribe
community-music [or,
community-music-digest] to
majordomo@a ustx.tandem.com
The community-music mailing list, established in July,
1995, allows those interested in community bands as well
as orchestras to share concerns, programs, and other
information. We also have some web resources, at
http://www.io.com/~rboerger/community.html , and I invite
anyone to have a look to see what the list is all about. PIANOFORTE (a list for discussion
of and by piano performers) To
subscribe, mail:
subscribe pianoforteA list for discussion among piano performers. Focuses on
classical piano. Archives are located at:
http://lists.oulu.fi/pianoforte/html/ PIPECHAT
PipeChat: A discussion List for pipe/digital organs &
related topics
PIPORG-L
PIPORG-L discusses musical, technical and historical
aspects of organs of all kinds -- classical, theater,
electronic, reed, tracker, electropneumatic, etc., etc.
Stoplists, recitals (past and future), recordings, jobs
(wanted and available), restoration hints, news of
progress in restoration projects are all interesting.
Requests for advice or information are encouraged, and
stories of your experiences and knowledge are eagerly
consumed. In short, if it is interesting and about organs,
this group would like to hear about it. 18-PNO-L mail
majordomo@earth.colstate.edu
with
subscribe 18-pno-lFor discussion of 18th century piano works 20-PNO-L mail
majordomo@earth.colstate.edu
with
subscribe 20-pno-lFor discussion of 20th century piano works PNO-FAC-L mail
majordomo@earth.colstate.edu
with
subscribe pno-fac-lFor discussion issues concerning piano faculties PNO-PED-L mail
majordomo@earth.colstate.edu
with:
subscribe pno-ped-lFor discussion of piano teaching. PNO-MED-L mail
majordomo@earth.colstate.edu
with
subscribe pno-med-lMedical issues concerning pianists
EUROMUSICOLOGY
Euromusicology is based on a network of
music departments established with EU
funding over the past 5 years in most of
the countries of Western and Central
Europe. It will be used for discussing
European issues in musicology and
publicizing forthcoming events and
matters of interest, etc. List home page
is:
To join ilm send the following command, (typing
your own personal names instead of firstname(s)
and lastname)
Ilm
To join med-and-ren-music send the following
command, (typing your own personal names
instead of firstname(s) and lastname)
med-and-ren-music
To join nineteenth-century-music send the following
command, (typing your own personal names
instead of firstname(s) and lastname)
nineteenth-century-music
To join musical-asesthetics send the following
command, (typing your own personal names
instead of firstname(s) and lastname)
musical-aesthetics
To join musicology-all send the following command,
(typing your own personal names instead of
firstname(s) and lastname)
Musicology-all is a masterlist of the
above lists. What this means is that when
you subscribe to musicology-all you have
subscribed to all of the above mailbase
musicology lists. So if you are interested
in joining all six, just join musicology-all.
Music-Research
The Music-Research electronic mail
redistribution list was established in Oxford in
July 1986, to provide an effective means of
bringing together musicologists, music
analysts, computer scientists, and others
working on applications of computers in music
research. As with any forum for discussion,
there are certain subject areas which are of
particular interest to the group of people on
this list. Initially, the list was established for
people whose chief interests concern
computers and their applications to music
representation systems, information retrieval
systems for mucial scores, music printing,
music analysis, musicology and
ethnomusicology and tertiary music education.
The following areas are not the principal
conern of this list, although overlapping
subjects may well be interesting: primary and
secondary education, sound generation
techniques and composition. Articles on
electronic music, synthesizers, MIDI, etc, will
be rejected and should be sent to the
appropriate alternative list. EMUSIC-L
This list is intended to serve those interested
in discussions of Electronic Music and all
attendant topics. Conversation is welcome and
encouraged on topics of Emusic composition,
criticism, technology, and technique. Timbral
research, MIDI programming, sly tricks for old
machines, reviews of new toys are all dear to
our hearts. Announcements of events and help
wanted are fine. Ads for commercial products
are not.
Classica
The basic purpose of the list is to serve as a
forum for scholarly discussions and as a
clearinghouse for the distribution of information
on concerts, performing opportunities,
academic conferences, publication
opportunities, fellowship information, academic
grants, and job openings of interest to
Classical Music scholars , performers or music
teachers and pupils.
Smt-list
List devoted to discussion of music theory by
professionals or soon-to-be professionals.
Mail list subscription and unsubscription FAQ and Good Manners FAQ
What are email lists?
Why join an email list?
How do email lists work?
ted@compuserve.com
alice@uu.net
al@aol.com
sue@netcom.com
listserv
list address: listname@system.dom
example: pottery-l@clay.com -- automated administrative address: listserv@system.dom
example: listserv@clay.com -- list owner address: listname-owner@system.dom
example: pottery-l-owner@clay.com
majordomo
list address: listname@system.dom
example: pottery-l@clay.com automated administrative address: majordomo@system.dom
example: majordomo@clay.com list owner address: listname-owner@system.dom
example: pottery-l-owner@clay.com
What are some basics I need to know?
To: jgreshes@netaxs.com
From: djones@aol.com
Subject: classical music email list directory Subscribing to a listserv list
set pottery-l digest
list address: listname-digest@system.dom
owner address: listname-digest-owner@system.dom
owner address: pottery-l-digest-owner@clay.com
unsubscribe listname
unsubscribe pottery-l
When you have completed the process to subscribe to a list, you will receive a welcome message. Welcome messages differ from list to list, but you should read them when you get them. The most basic welcome message will welcome you to the list and tell you how to unsubscribe from the list. Unless you are an old pro with mail lists and know how to operate the various list software programs, you should save the welcome message so that you will know how to get off the list. Unsubscribing is a simple process, but tasks the minds of many people. Those people would find the process much easier if they would just save the instructions.
More involved welcome messages will tell you more about operating the list administration program--again save this stuff and read it before you ask questions. The welcome message might also tell you about the list, about some of the list members, and a bout the listowner. Finally, the message may contain a FAQ--a set of Frequently Asked Questions that answers the most common questions people have about the list, list software, or, sometimes, the topic of the list. Again, save the welcome message and read the welcome message if their is a FAQ. If you later ask a question on the list that is answered in the FAQ, some people will tell you to just go read the FAQ. Believe it or not, the same questions come up again and again. Don't assume that you and your situation are so unusual that no one has ever been there before. ;)
Two: Get used to your surrounds, but also say hello.
When you join a list, it is a good idea to just read the list for a few days so that you understand the environment you have entered. As I've mentioned, some lists focus on a particular topic, others are more free-wheeling . The best way for you to find out what is he list culture of a list is read the list. However, you can--and are encouraged to--send a message introducing yourself to the list. You don't need a resume--no one is checking your ID. It's just that lists are social in nature, and as in any other social gathering it's a nice touch to introduce yourself. Also, the members of the list do not receive any kind of notification that you have joined. If you don't introduce yourself, no one will know you are there.
Generally, read the list for a couple of days, then introduce yourself, and then continue to read the list for a couple more days, leaving your posting to responses to those that reply to your introduction. Once you feel you understand how discussion goes on the list, feel free to post away. If you notice that the list is very slow and you are not getting any messages to read, then feel free to cut loose. It may be that 100 hundred people are also sitting there waiting for someone else to post. (That happens a lot with new lists. People are used to being to told to not dive right in, but since the list is new no one is posting. So no one ever posts because everyone is sitting around waiting for one another. When you know a list is a new list, you can offer a great deal of assistance by getting posting started.) Which brings us to rule three:
Three: If a message is of interest to the list, send it to the list. If your message is intended for one person, mail that person privately.
Do not use the list to chat with one person.Lists exist to facilitate group discussion. When you and another person are just trading messages back and forth, with the content being of no interest to others than yourselves, there is no reason to involve the list. Email each other privately, directly. There are other times you should email privately, instead of through the list. If someone has annoyed you in one of their posts and you can not respond other than in an angry and possibly offensive way, mail them privately. The person may have made an honest mistake and several hundred other people don't need more negativity. Other obvious examples--if you just want to say to someone "Good post, pal." email them privately. If you and someone else want to trade magazines, or recordings, or books or something, do the deals in private mail. People will post publicly that they have a certain item, but responses belong in private mail.
Four: The new guy/new gal doesn't tell the long-timers what to do.
This happens all the time on classm-l. Classm-l has been around for years. Classm-l is a list made up of people that enjoy classical music, but who don't use the list only to discuss classical music. That's how the list developed years ago, and many of those old-timers are still around. Others haven't been around quite as long, but like that aspect of the list and have stayed on the list. Then some yutz subscribes, sees that the list works that way, and immediately starts bitching that everyone is wasting his/her time, stop talking about all this other stuff, this is a classical music list so only talk about classical music, etc. etc. etc. And the answer is: buddy, this is how the list is, this is how it always has been, cope with it. If you don't like it, unsubscribe. Stop complaining.
And that's the way all the lists are. Some only discuss classical music. Some only discuss piano. Whatever the list topic, don't expect to subscribe to a list and tell everyone on the list what they will now do. The fact that you have joined the list doesn't give you any more power than you have being invited over to friend's place for a party. You don't show up at your friend's house and tell them, "Get a different wine, change the drapes, move the couch over into that corner, and, by the way, stop inviting the Johnsons from down the street b/c I don't like them." It just doesn't work that way.
Five: Lurkers don't set the rules
This is another thing that happens all the time. Someone that has been on the list for months and has never participated, has never posted a thing, and has never offered any contribution to the list suddenly announces "This list stinks b/c it never discusses X. " Or, "This list stinks because people are always talking about Y." If you want the list to talk about something, talk about it. If others are interested, they will join you. If they aren't interested, cope with it. Also, it may be that some are interested, but not in the particular aspect you brought up. Try again. If you want the list to move on from discussing a subject, bring up a new subject. In other words, you can have an effect on the list by participating in the daily conversation on the list, not by sitting in shadows and tossing in an occasional complaint. People that just read the list and don't participate are called lurkers. The active subscribers don't think about lurkers much, and most of the time don't worry about them. They do get very upset, however, when a lurker tries to tell them what to do.
Six: Send unsubscribe messages to the list program. If that doesn't work, write the listowner.
Let's get one thing out of the way--when you join a list you get a message telling you how to leave the list. So no one has hidden anything from you. If you toss away that message and can't find it later, that's no one's fault but your own. The only time the list software can't successfully unsubscribe someone is if that person's system administrators have modified the subscriber's address since he subscribed. So if you can't get off a list, don't annoy the list members, don't complain to the list, and do not send "Get me off this ****ing list" messages to the list. (Yeah, people send those.) If you can't get off the list it is because you lost the instructions on how to do so, aren't following them properly, or your system has screwed up your address--none of which is the other list member's problem. Write to the listowner (I've given instructions above telling you what address to write to), and if you don't get a response (and keep in mind that list owners do this as a hobby, not as a job. You aren't paying them to be on their list--so don't get hot with them if they don't respond immediately to your requests) write to the list asking that someone forward you the list welcome message and/or the unsubscribe instructions.
Seven: Lists are like real life, if you give attitude you get attitude.
Self explanatory. One thing to keep in mind is that some lists (like classm-l) expect you to fend for yourself. So fights end either when one person has beaten up the other, or when the members of the list have become disgusted with one person or both people.
On other lists, offending parties may be contacted by the listowner.
For insults, additions, or anything else concerning this page, mail jgreshes@netaxs.com